What are our tags going to represent?

I'd also like to see a tag for 1-2 man roaming groups/camp flippers. Perhaps Gold would still work for this: if you see a gold tag wandering in enemy territory, you know it's a camp-flipper, not an upgrader.

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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I didn't see the purpose for a scout tag, but now that I think about it, I like it.  I agree with the above suggestions!

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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They changed it due to player feedback Fog -> 300g for the tag and all colors.

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/wuv/wuv/Commander-Tag-Changes-Feedback-merged/page/10#post4313965

---------------------------------------
LGN: Soren the Always Lost
Gaiscioch Family [GSCH]

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Yeah, without the change, this would be nearly impossible. Thankfully they heard the outcry!

If we have frequent scouts or roamers who would like to tag up while they do it but need gold, we should try to get them a tag before the 9th. I don't mind donating a bit of gold out of my Legendary fund if I need to.

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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I think some are under the idea that they have pulled the 300/g per color and are now allowing the purchase of the tag alone to cover all colors, I would like to ask for a link on this because I have not seen it yet.  I think the closest that I have seen to saying this was a vague post on GW2.com but I didn't see it as being clear.  Until then I am forced to agree with Fog.  However it would still be a good idea to consider color meanings for the long term and get it established to if someone where to buy a color or two what they would represent in our WvW.

I know I for one would personally like to see us use a new color to represent a Guild Group or training group.  I would like to see this as it would represent "this is not the main group, we are out here to train members or have a guild event... All are welcome to join but our goals may be slightly different then a primary force, we are larger then a havoc group, but much smaller then a zerg"(maybe purple covers this already per above). One thing we all hate is to see a 12+ man guild group not tagged up on a map with no other tags.  It doesn't seem inviting and it looks elitist.  With this option it is a little less secretive and people would know exactly what is going on.  They could join, but they would be accepting that the group is not really running the big show, it then allows others to call them for assistance if really needed without spamming map chats. 

I think SSKRIPKO's assignment of colors is good enough.  Blue needs to be the default map tag, so lets not get to fancy.

Mistress Collisto|Molly Oakenheart|Lena Andersdotter|Heather Jones
Guild Leader of [JADE] www.Immortalizedin.enjin.com

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Was checking for the same thing as well, they posted on the WvW thread though:

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/wuv/wuv/Commander-Tag-Changes-Feedback-merged/page/10

Looks like all the feedback worked this time around.

Envy the Madman his musings when Death comes to make Fools of us all.

The Murder Junkies
GW1/PoTBS/WAR/GW2/CU

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Alternatively, saw this suggestion on Reddit: try to map the commander tags to the colors used for chat.

Gold = Guild Chat = Guild groups, could probably also work for Bounce?

Red = Map/Team Chat = Main Blob

Blue = Party Chat = Havoc groups

Purple = nothing = Roamers/Scouts?

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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My vote:

Gold = Guild/Havoc groups (any guild group bigger than a havoc group would likely be a part of the main zerg or the bounce group)

Red = Main zerg(s) (same color as /m and stands out as the main group)

Blue = Bouncers (BBs)

Purple = Roamers/scouts (meh, it's all that's really left, lol) 

But I'm new here so there's that. : p

- Charlie -
Guild Leader of Ascalonian Ghostbusters [ECTO] - an original SoR Guild - www.ectoguild.com
Current 80s - Arms Murphy (W)| Pumpsandabump (G)| Nicolas Rayge (R)| Karysta Raine (M)| Eiryn Blak (El)| Alexa Stoutcheste (T)| Billy The Kit (En)| Niteris (N)

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I would keep the havoc and guild separate. Guild and event might be closer since both might be trying to do something outside the normal and might indicate to people that something special might be underway. Havoc and scouts might be closer in size and roles. 

Main Force 

Reaction Force (could also be defined as roaming main force from another map) 

Guild/Event 

Havoc/Scouts

Flexible on colors, the thought of matching some to chat color does make some sense. 

Good hunting!

Envy the Madman his musings when Death comes to make Fools of us all.

The Murder Junkies
GW1/PoTBS/WAR/GW2/CU

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Okay. I'm on board with that.

Main tag red.

Guild or havoc gold.

Bouncing blue.

Scout or Roamers purple.

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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How about Protein Bar is the only one flying a Gold tag :P and everyone else is a mixture of the rest???

These are all good suggestions..so which one would we be following and how will we decide? 

Officer of [FIRE]Chariot of Fire also known as ProteinBar

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I've always enjoyed a good survey for things like this. If people want to vote/decide another way that's fine, or I went ahead and threw one together real quick.

https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/73R8JX3

- Charlie -
Guild Leader of Ascalonian Ghostbusters [ECTO] - an original SoR Guild - www.ectoguild.com
Current 80s - Arms Murphy (W)| Pumpsandabump (G)| Nicolas Rayge (R)| Karysta Raine (M)| Eiryn Blak (El)| Alexa Stoutcheste (T)| Billy The Kit (En)| Niteris (N)

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Keep in mind that there will be a number of players who are used to looking for blue tags only (there is a large number of people who don't read news or patchnotes, I still see people asking in map chat 'whoa, what happened to Lion's Arch????'), so whichever function we want to use blue for mainly, that'll be the colour most likely to attract the bigger number of players, at least initially.

On the other hand, people seeing new colours might think 'ooh, new colour, that must be special!' and go there... so hmm, I guess we will have to wait and see.

There probably will also be some players who will just pick the tag that is their favourite colour :p (which is why I am sad there's no orange tags, why do you do this, Arenanet!!!!!!)

Cholv (l80 warrior)
Vloch (l80 guardian)
Fiander (l80 elementalist)
Danthres (l80 ranger)

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Main tag needs to be blue.  Change that color and you'll invite a host of confusion problems with players.  Keep in mind that SOR is not a Tier 1 server with a bunch of regulars anymore, so its not a good idea to make it complicated and discourage casuals and newbies.

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I'm going to give a counter-argument: if the main tag is blue, most players won't bother to figure out what the other tags are. They'll just keep following the blue one.

If, instead, the only tag on the map is red - or they go to a blue tag and it's a small group - that might push them toward asking what the colors mean. 

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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I agree with TimmyF on this one, was even planning on saying exactly that before he beat me to it. Speaking as one of those casual newbies (new to WvW at least), I know my first reaction to seeing different colors on the map would be to ask which one to follow. 

- Charlie -
Guild Leader of Ascalonian Ghostbusters [ECTO] - an original SoR Guild - www.ectoguild.com
Current 80s - Arms Murphy (W)| Pumpsandabump (G)| Nicolas Rayge (R)| Karysta Raine (M)| Eiryn Blak (El)| Alexa Stoutcheste (T)| Billy The Kit (En)| Niteris (N)

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The average casual WvW player is not going to be able to tell the difference in commander tags with different colors, and most will not care.  They will be confused so I think it is better to keep it simple.  By running around with a bunch of different colors you will turn some people off on wvw.  I say stick with at most two colors, blue for the main commander and whatever other color you should all decide on for secondary commanders on the same battleground. 

Additionally, Commander tags on a group of 5 or less is too confusing and frankly If you cannot control your group of 5 or less without a tag you shouldn't be commanding.  Once your group gets to be 6 or more, then by all means use a tag.  I see too many commanders running around solo, or with 2 or 3 people, like I said no need for a tag!

BTW not all of us like running Team Speak, sorry its just not an intuitive program for me so I don't use it and the constant "user did this or user did that" is a PITA. 

Kaytlyn

» Edited on: 2014-08-21 21:22:57

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Although I understand your points Kaytlyn, one thing you do not realize until you command is that when you where the "main" tag, it now becomes your job to manage the entire map... Not just your zerg.  When is the best time to strike a target?  When they are preoccupied somewhere else... When a small group can have a tag with a color designated for it, all it requires is the main commander to quickly check where the other group is on the map and strike at the same time or just after.  It is a great tool for planning an attack... As you said you don't use TS... How can the commander communicate to find out your location?  Typing this information is to cumbersome.  A different color tag would be a benefit especially for those not in TS. 

As far as Timmyf goes, those people who are not as dedicated in WvW would probably feel more at home continuing to follow the blue tag if it represents the main group anyways.

I don't think this will turn anyone off, and if it does, I hate to say it, but they probably wont fair well in WvW to begin with and wont like it no matter how few tags are running. 

I have commanded a few times really late at night, and I can tell you that a tag on the map even if you start with 3 people will attract and keep more people on the map.  Many people are turned off of WvW when they get on a map and there are no tags, imagine if they had choices on what they wanted to do that day and all they had to do was find the colored tag representing that. 

It is our job as users of this forum and those attending the meetings in TS to pass on the meaning of each color once it is settled and if used.

All valid points by all, and we should consider all the views on this, but lets keep in mind it will be hard to change once we made a choice.

Mistress Collisto|Molly Oakenheart|Lena Andersdotter|Heather Jones
Guild Leader of [JADE] www.Immortalizedin.enjin.com

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Kaytlin,

Then turn it off.  The User Joined Channel, etc is a setting that is customizable.  Too easy to turn it off.  TS is the standard for the server for our WvW community.  If a commander chooses to not participate with the rest of the community, then he is limiting himself and his communication capabilities with the other commanders who are in fact on Commander Comms (CCOMS)...and those that are trying to follow the commander and are on TS waiting for commands. But this is the age-old debate with GSCH and the rest of SoR.  GSCH wants to hide in Raidcall (except for those select few that do participate with out community when raiding...and those commanders like Hella Vanka, Fog, Aiobheann, etc that do lead on both).  But the TS vs Raidcall debate is honestly for another thread, because that has nothing to do with Commander Tag colors.

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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Exactly what Mistress Collisto, said. In this case, the commander tag can be used as an indicator of who is where, not necessarily as a tool for commanding. If you have a group of 5 or less do you need a tag to lead them? Absolutely not, but that's not why we want to use the multiple tags. If I have a scout group of 4-5 people, and we designate that scouts are, say purple, then I can tag up as purple and the whole map will know where the scout group is. Then, if (while scouting) I see something worth calling in reinforcements to, I can call to other people on the map to rally at my scout tag.

- Charlie -
Guild Leader of Ascalonian Ghostbusters [ECTO] - an original SoR Guild - www.ectoguild.com
Current 80s - Arms Murphy (W)| Pumpsandabump (G)| Nicolas Rayge (R)| Karysta Raine (M)| Eiryn Blak (El)| Alexa Stoutcheste (T)| Billy The Kit (En)| Niteris (N)

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I'm not a military guy, so those of you who are can correct me if I have my history wrong, but I'm under the impression that one of the greatest advances in real-life warfare came when computers and GPS technology reached a point where battlefield commanders could see where all their resources were on a map in real-time.

Being able to quickly determine where your get groups are -  blobs, havocs, roamers, scouts - means that you as a Commander can make better decisions. Want to head across the map to grab a tower? If there's a scout or roamer in the area, you can ask for a siege report. Is anybody in the tower? Do they have arrow carts up? A gate treb? Defended a keep but low on siege? Ask a roamer near south camp to flip it.

Having lots of tags on the map is actually only necessary BECAUSE people don't get in Teamspeak. If 100% of the map was in TS, you could just ask in the channel and get a fast response. (Well, I still think having the map indicators will give a nice visual overview, but I think you guys can see what I mean.)

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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I don't think anyone here thinks that havocs and scouts need a tag for themselves, its to help the people leading the larger groups to know that they don't need to take 50 to capture something that 5 could take, and that they are already taking. Likewise, it also allows a larger force to react to multiple targets at once versus running in a train and only getting one thing done. 

People will be confused, this should be planned for, but would rather have the feature in game to allow people to manage the field better than not use it. Have to agree with Mistress Collisto above, we have a large number of people that will zone in, see zero tags and zone out versus move out by themselves. Even if they see just havocs running around that might encourage them to head out to the fight. Good hunting.

Envy the Madman his musings when Death comes to make Fools of us all.

The Murder Junkies
GW1/PoTBS/WAR/GW2/CU

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Well from looking at the discussion here, it seems like Gold being for Guild/Havoc groups, and Purple being for Scouts/Roamers is pretty unanimous. The only thing we need to decide on is between Main large group and Bouncers it seems. I'm still a fan of the Red = main being that /m and /t are both red, and Blue = Bouncers, but I'd honestly be ok with either.

I say we go with Gold being for Guild/Havoc, Purple = Scout/Roam and we cast votes/discuss the decision for blue and red. My vote is Red = Main, Blue = Bounce.

- Charlie -
Guild Leader of Ascalonian Ghostbusters [ECTO] - an original SoR Guild - www.ectoguild.com
Current 80s - Arms Murphy (W)| Pumpsandabump (G)| Nicolas Rayge (R)| Karysta Raine (M)| Eiryn Blak (El)| Alexa Stoutcheste (T)| Billy The Kit (En)| Niteris (N)

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Mistress Collisto

I have been commanding in GW2 for just a few missions, so I know perhaps just a little of what I am speaking about.  You can check my credits on the Gaiscioch site if you must.  Am I the best commander on the field, absolutely not.  There are far better commanders, and that is to be expected.  Do the people that run with me have a good time, ask them! That is my goal when leading to make the gaming experience of those that follow my TAG fun.  If you speak with the folks that run with me you can ask them when the last time I spoke down to anyone was, or the last time I raised my voice at them.  How many of you can say the same thing?  Do we try and assist the server when we can, that's pretty much what we do. Try and pull the zergs off of our main force so they can take the larger objectives, but we do it for fun. It is not focused on "scoring the most points."   Do I require a specific build, or class or level, no! I will not do that!

Perhaps you have not encountered the so called commanders who tag up by themselves. In tier one they were everywhere. Anyone with a hundred gold could be a "leader".  Some would tag up and spend their entire day taking materials from towers and keeps so they could get their titles.  Didn't matter if the other commanders on the field needed the supply to try and regain the things this commander had ignored. 

If I come into a borderland and another commander is present, as a courtesy I leave and try and find another borderland.  I do not want their people becoming confused, nor do I want new players to be confused as to where they should go.  Nor do I want to have troll commanders on the field who spend their time telling us how they want us to play, in map and team chat.  Nor do I want to be trolled on a voice communication system with no one to control it.

Where I see this whole thing going is a push to get back to Tier 1, and if that is what you all are looking for so be it.  I wish you all luck, for the game no longer is a game in Tier 1, it is a grind, that brings out the worst in people, it's  "job!"  You can correct me if I am wrong. Won't be the first time I was incorrect, and won't be the last. 

A leader without a following is not a leader but someone trying to show off, and unfortunately there are far to many of them right now.

Xivor, As for teamspeak where would you like to have an honest discussion about its merits or lack there of?  You dont have to troll me, or my guild,  because you don't like RaidCall, or because you like TS.  It has nothing to do with one guild or another liking or disliking TS.  What it has to do with is the lack of control by TS moderators regarding Trolling, and Profanity.  That is why I do not use TS. It has nothing to do with a guild not participating, it is MY OPINION AND MY CHOICE!  I highlighted it so you might understand that this is a personal rejection of TS with valid reasons.

Kaytlyn

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First off, I would like to apologize for your perception that I was trolling you.  I most assuradly am not.  I have many friends in GSCH, I am friends with Foghlada, and I work together with him on the WvW War Council.  I have been on the GSCH Raidcall many times for Great Tyrian Adventure, SORC missions, or just plain fellowship.  Several of my guildies in FIRE also are members of GSCH, and FIRE actually originated on Raidcall as our primary source of communication.

However, in order to work as a team, we must communicate as a team.  And I know a lot of things about teamwork, because it is the backbone of what I do for a career.  One team, one fight.  That being said, regardless of the personal decision to participate or not to participate on Teamspeak as a guild, all WvW commanders from GSCH that I have interactive with have commanded on TS as well...except for you.  But, you have your opinions, and I respect them.  That being said, if profanity and the lack of a "family-friendly" environment is your concern, then please, by all means, speak to me one on one with any and all examples of those that have made the TS a very unfriendly place to be.  Because this is something that I am very focused on assuring does NOT happen.  We WANT everyone to be welcomed and not be pushed away because of profanity and sexual content.  For this reason, there are designated channels for "uncensored conversation".  This very topic has actually come up several times in recent weeks because, like with any large community, there will be mistakes made that need to be addressed.  And we addressed them.

Again, I apologize, as I came across more contentious as I intended to.  If there is any way I can be of assistance to you in such a way to help unify you with the rest of our commanders and our WvW community, please let me know.  And no, T1 is not the intention.  If you were there in our server reset meetings (and maybe you are??), you would know that.  There is a reason why we fell like we did; elitism took hold, and those people moved on to the place where it suited them best...to stay in T1. We are better than that. Much better than that.

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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Kaytlyn, I also apologize if your took what I had to say personally, I was trying to direct it more to the context that you mentioned and for others with those views, not on you directly.  Fun always needs to be our first goal out in WvW as commanders, and general players. 

Those who are more dedicated however, these tag combos will help and hopefully help them tick the PPT higher which is the goal of WvW like it or not.  I like the tier we are on, it offers great enjoyment but also comes with a lot of frustration.  Its all good though, everyone seems so much more laid back and friendly and that is something we need to save no matter where we go in the ranks.

TS vs RC or others... Not usually an issue, I run both at the same time so that my guildies who can't form a sentence without the "F" bomb can stay in RC, those that are social and not offensive come into TS.  On top of that I try to insure one of my guildies works as my scribe if I forget to type something(which is often)

Kaytlyn, this is directed to you....  I look forward to fighting next to you on the field. :) Hopefully we don't die together, but I will take that chance for a fellow server member.

Mistress Collisto|Molly Oakenheart|Lena Andersdotter|Heather Jones
Guild Leader of [JADE] www.Immortalizedin.enjin.com

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I hope you are both correct.  I have been on teamspeak since the most recent changes and I have been trolled. So, that being said, I will again give it a chance.  But understand, trying to communicate on RaidCall and Teamspeak simultaneously is difficult, at best, and I spent 12 years in communications in the field, and have contested as a ham radio operator where hundreds are trying to speak at the same time.  But trying to lead, not get people killed, and still let them have a good time will be my main focus, while trying to manipulate two voice communication channels will be a challenge,  I am after all not a spring chicken anymore.

And Xivor, I spent 12 years in the marines, the last 6 of which were as a Staff Sergent.  I appreciate all that has been said by all. I will give it a try and go with whatever you all decide to do, as I said above.  I just pray that we do not go back to the "Tier 1 days".  I did not enjoy them nor did most of the players who have remained with us since those days.

I love this game and the people playing it and only want everyone to have a good time!

Kaytlyn

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I just want red to be havoc. I want to run havoc groups all over the place with a red tag :D Anything else i don't care. 

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So, what's the verdict on this? I plan on tagging up when I'm roaming/capping towers and supply camps with my guild and want to know what color I should use. I know we've still got time before the FP hits, but I'd like to know ahead of time what the plan is.

- Charlie -
Guild Leader of Ascalonian Ghostbusters [ECTO] - an original SoR Guild - www.ectoguild.com
Current 80s - Arms Murphy (W)| Pumpsandabump (G)| Nicolas Rayge (R)| Karysta Raine (M)| Eiryn Blak (El)| Alexa Stoutcheste (T)| Billy The Kit (En)| Niteris (N)

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I think the safe assumption is that within our organized WvW community, we are going to hold the standard of using the following:

BLUE  -Main Map Force

RED - Roaming Force

GOLD - Guild Force

PURPLE - Havoc (7 or less)

I know there is an argument for RED to be the primary map force.  My thoughts on this: if a random Rallian that is not immersed in our community joins, he is going to be looking for the blue tag.  That has been the standard for the longest time.  He may not know what the other colors are for because he is not on this site reading this thread.  So, he will go after that blue tag.  You don't want to be switching maps with a bunch of randoms all the time, because you will often lose part of your force.  For this reason, I feel RED should be the roaming tag, abd BLUE should be the map force.

And, a tag for scouts?  Most scouts are not going to have a commander tag.  I think it is pointless to have a tag for someone to sit in a keep.  If we need a tag to know we have a scout on the map, then our usage of scouts and the incoming scout reports is seriously flawed.

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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Well, I think Red = Map Blue = Roaming makes a lot more sense. That said, if we can't get word out within our community that the main map tag color has changed, we have much bigger problems than what those specific decisions are.

Communication is essential in warfare. Developing simple, effective server communication methods is going to be a  necessary first step to improving.

Anyway, I'll respect the decision made by whomever decides these things. War Council, I guess.

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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Oh this is not a War Council thing; this is a community decision  I haven't really posted much on this topic; just seeing the interaction with everyone else.  Personally, I feel either color works.  But, I think there is something to consider for those players that are not engaged in our community...i.e. new players, PvE players, etc.  Maybe I am looking too deeply into it, too. 

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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Serious question: how should a new player know to follow blue anyway? They're new regardless.

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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New to WvW.  Sorry I didn't clarify.  I know MANY people just know "follow the blue dorito" without thinking about it.  In PvE or WvW.  Probably half my guild is like that!

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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" I know MANY people just know "follow the blue dorito" without thinking about it" 

Just my 2 cents, but I think the new colors is a perfect opportunity to change this mindset. Just "follow the blue dorito" like a lemming should be something that we seek to change anyway (again, just my opinion) by teaching people WHY they follow X dorito. You do make a fair point about this being many people's natural instinct, but it's an instinct that promotes mindless interaction, not one that promotes better communication.

If someone joins a map and just "follows the blue dorito" and the blue dorito is jumping maps they might notice that there's a red dorito that hasn't jumped map, or a purple one, or a gold one, and then ask what those colors mean. If that same person joins a map and follows the blue dorito like they would now, they might not ever have reason to find out what the other colors are for, they'll just follow the blue dorito like a mindless drone with no idea of why they're doing it.

That was a looooong 2 cents....sorry.

- Charlie -
Guild Leader of Ascalonian Ghostbusters [ECTO] - an original SoR Guild - www.ectoguild.com
Current 80s - Arms Murphy (W)| Pumpsandabump (G)| Nicolas Rayge (R)| Karysta Raine (M)| Eiryn Blak (El)| Alexa Stoutcheste (T)| Billy The Kit (En)| Niteris (N)

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You make a good point. But is that point worth basing a color decision for an entire server off of? My thoughts are in support of the masses. Functionally, what color goes for map groups and what color for roaming groups is irrelevant. Functionally speaking, they do the same thing. But it would cause more confusion for the random I think if we make blue a map hop tag. Either way wouldn't affect our everyday players like you and I. It's the others I am speaking about. 

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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The reason to make red the map tag is so that we have the easy explanation of "tag color compares to chat box color." The reason to make blue the map tag is so that casuals who follow the dorito without caring, asking questions, or being involved in the community run with the map tag instead of the rotating map tag.

I'd rather a system that makes sense for the players who take the time to learn what things mean, not simply cater to people who can't even bring themselves to ask which color tag they should follow.

Said with less contempt: I work in the training and change management field. One constant between basically any organization is that they have policies or procedures which make no sense to anybody. Why do you do this completely senseless thing? "That's what we've always done."

Bad habits are hard, or impossible, to break. It's much easier to do it the right way and teach people the right way from the get-go. Or a year or two from now, nobody will understand why "gold = guild" but "red != map."

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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That's kind of my reasoning as well. I work in I/T and the response of "because that's the way we've always done it" makes my skin crawl. This is very different than people trying to justify using Access '97 because their databases are only compatible with that version or using Windows XP because they're "used to it" or something, but the basic principle still remains. Teaching people the right way to do things doesn't always mean keeping things the way they've always been, and that's sometimes a good thing. I agree that switching from Blue = Main group to Red = main group might be confusing at first, but in time it will become the new "way it's always been" and making that change now will be much easier than trying to do it later. 

- Charlie -
Guild Leader of Ascalonian Ghostbusters [ECTO] - an original SoR Guild - www.ectoguild.com
Current 80s - Arms Murphy (W)| Pumpsandabump (G)| Nicolas Rayge (R)| Karysta Raine (M)| Eiryn Blak (El)| Alexa Stoutcheste (T)| Billy The Kit (En)| Niteris (N)

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 Blue = Main group to Red = main group might be confusing at first

So confusing even we can't get it right yet! ;-)

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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If the majority want red = map and blue = roaming, then that's fine. But, I felt it was worth pushing the logic (or lack thereof). 

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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Colors don't matter to me and I will be sure to pass it on to those in my guild, and those I run into. 

I like that Gold(Yellow) is Guild, other then that I could care less if the other colors are changed as long as the meanings are established like they are.  I think the attempt to connect things like Gold=Guild, Red=map because chat is red... I find this more of an OCD thing or someone has a favorite color they want to use then something truly meaningful(as in my case for Guild=Yellow, I would love to wear this tag for the simple reason it is yellow, and not because Guild=Gold).  This is not meant as an insult to anyone, I sometimes feel I am in the minority on reasoning things like this.  I see a value in what is being said both ways, either in leaving it Blue(easiest, no change not having to address this meaning for the next 2 years) or Red to assist those who need to attach more to it. 

I do however like the choices made for what tags will mean....  Don't care on color, I will pass it on, the rest of you in this chat can hash it out.  Please once a formal decision is made post so I can attach to my guilds website and pass it on.  We should have this settled on or before 9/5 so we can get the word out before it goes live.

-Main Map Force

- Roaming Force

- Guild Force

- Havoc (7 or less)

Mistress Collisto|Molly Oakenheart|Lena Andersdotter|Heather Jones
Guild Leader of [JADE] www.Immortalizedin.enjin.com

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Honestly, I much like sscripko 's first post for colorings. I am generally only in WvW on the weekends. We tend to hang out in the roaming havoc group room and for my own personal preference, I would like to have them purple but that is for my own want of running with a purple tag. Also, as Mistress Collisto's personal scribe, I generally follow him around anyway, so me having a tag isn't so important. :)

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I don't think the colors need an innate setting, personally.  It can be handled on map when multiple tags pops in and they explain to the map what they're doing and what color they are.  If a scout is tracking an enemy zerg and pops a tag letting the Main force Commander know their location and what to get ready for.  The only people who will know to follow a set category for colors will be people who frequently enter WVW and follow this site.  PVE is getting colors as well, so eventually the "follow the blue dorito" is going to change to just "follow the rainbow".  It's going to be something that will have to be explained on each map every time whenever multiple tags are up regardless of what we all decide on as a general utility for colors on the Battlefront.

We've made it this long using one color, it's not going to suddenly get harder to track your commander.  Remember, once you're in your commander's squad all you see is their tag anyway.

-Dharkon

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There needs to be a decision so that there is no confusion when this starts. Personally I like Sscripko's initial suggestions:

Blue - The Main Tag resident to a map.  For example, if you are planning on staying on EB, use the blue tag so people know you aren't bouncing around.

Gold - Scout/Upgrader.  The person who is either scouting at a location, or as we often have, running back and forth between 2/3 towers, camps and keeps.  It would let us see those who are scouting easily.  I know that not everyone has a tag, but a large number of our players do (and many would never turn them on in WvW, they were bought for PvE)

Red - Boom Boom Bounce tag.  A tag for the group that is map-hopping all over the place.  This also helps for when the map-hopping group has to bounce in to do map defense.  It will help keep the two groups from crossing paths, and then having to spend 3 minutes sorting out who is now following which commander.

Purple - Havoc group.  It would be used when we have a large group on the map, and your small group is back-capping/camp-flipping, and doing all those other havoc things.  For example, HALO would run the purple tag (with our 5-7) on reset night, to IMPS 20-25 (or EG's 50-60) on the blue tag.  It let's their commander know where we are, and doesn't confuse people with two identical tags. 

I like them because they also follow the same outlay for our TS server and what ppl are doing already. Either way there needs to be a final decision and it needs to be mapped out before this comes out. Also, if whatever we pick doesn't work, we can change it.

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It seemed like the majority chose the map chat similar colors:

RED  - Main Map Force

BLUE - Roaming Force

GOLD - Guild Force

PURPLE - Havoc (7 or less)

I am going to say that this will be the standard.

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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For those that are trying to say Red should equal Home groups because it matches map chat, but then at the same time saying Gold equals Guild because they both start with "G", Red then should equal Roaming...  Seems to me most of this discussion on red and blue is that some people are bored with blue and just want a change.  Personally I would have never associated Team or Map chat with the color of the tag.  Just think, with Purple equaling Havoc, we could then change the term from Havoc to "Perping" :p

I have done a little digging in other "communities"... Most if not all that I have observed there discussions on are sticking with blue for the simple fact that no matter how much you try to get people involved, and to change, reality is... It will never happen.  We all wish more of the community would get involved and ask questions, but lets face the facts, it wont.

I am in the boat of leaving Blue = map for the simple reason that most casuals will jump to that tag, and if we get transfers over from other servers, this will be the most common set up.

None of us know the details quite yet on how this color changing system will exactly work in game... It could be that blue is just the default and if you want to use another color you actually have to click it.  If blue is in fact the default color it would be more reason to leave it as is.  If one commander goes down, another can tag up to keep the zerg there while still engaged in the fight and not having to click more buttons for something other then an attack.

Mistress Collisto|Molly Oakenheart|Lena Andersdotter|Heather Jones
Guild Leader of [JADE] www.Immortalizedin.enjin.com

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"For those that are trying to say Red should equal Home groups because it matches map chat, but then at the same time saying Gold equals Guild because they both start with "G""

No. Guild chat is yellow. So the yellow tag matches yellow chat. (Whether you call the color "yellow" or "gold" is irrelevant, it's the same color.)

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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I am with Collisto on this one, but frankly, I think this is too trivial of a thing to have a long, drawn out voting process.  We need to just pick one and announce it as the standard.

Combat Medic Barbie | Mist Walker Barbie | Rigor Mortis Barbie

Guild Leader of Chariot of Fire [FIRE]

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I think we're all pretty much in agreement on one thing: the actual choices matter less than making a decision and informing everybody. We just need somebody to make that decision. Quickly, if possible.

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Karaoke (Loki | Oaky | Pokey | Smokey | Croaky | Cloaky | Soaky | Gnocchi)
Guild Leader - Super Mega Happy Fun Time [MEGA] - supermegahappyfuntime.com

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In all likelihood the rest of this week will be a mess of skittles on all maps, hopefully a dominant style emerges out of that in time for Friday. If not, a few guilds need to group up with a common definition of what each color means and basically say "hey, this is what we are going to be using, take it or leave it." That's just the way I see it...

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Senpai Kush
[OMEN]

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